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RE: signal design for new layout - DB 1954

#1 von applor , 24.07.2016 01:44

Hello everyone,

First, I apologise I do not speak German so I will provide translation with google below the English after each section.
I am looking for someone to check my plan to see if my signal placement is correct for my new layout design which I am about to begin construction of.

Erstens, ich entschuldige mich, ich spreche kein Deutsch, so dass ich nach jedem Abschnitt Übersetzung mit Google unter dem englischen bieten.
Ich suche jemanden, der mein Plan zu überprüfen, um zu sehen, ob meine Signal Platzierung für mein neues Layout-Design richtig ist, die ich bin über den Bau eines zu beginnen.


First, we have the area with branch station.

Here I have used 3 signals to protect entry into the branch line that leads back to the station.
I have used speed boards here as well as trains approaching are required to slow to 40km/h before the points and for the trains leaving they can accelerate to 60km/h.

The branch station area is under local control so we have a trapezoid to indicate this and a halt board for the station track.

On the lower main line dual track areas, we have standard stop/go signals paired with distant signals.
The track heading into the main station on the right side uses a Vr0/Vr2 signal (prepare to stop or prepare to go slow) since the next signal is for station entry.
All the others are standard Vr0/Vr1.

Erstens haben wir den Bereich mit Zweigstation .

Hier habe ich drei Signale verwendet den Eintritt in die Zweigleitung zu schützen, die zurück zum Bahnhof führt.
Ich habe Speed-Boards verwendet hier sowie Züge erforderlich nähern zu 40 km / h, bevor die Punkte und für die Züge langsam verlassen sie zu 60 km / h beschleunigen kann.

Die Zweigbahnhofsbereich ist unter lokaler Kontrolle, so dass wir ein Trapez, um anzuzeigen, diese und einen Stopp-Board für den Bahnhofsgleis haben.

Auf den unteren Hauptlinie zweigleisigen Bereichen, haben wir Standard Stopp / mit entfernten Signale gepaart Signale gehen.
Die Strecke auf der rechten Seite in die Hauptstation Überschrift verwendet ein Vr0 / Vr2 Signal (Vorbereitung zu stoppen oder vorbereiten zu gehen langsam), da das nächste Signal für Stationseintrag ist.
Alle anderen sind Standard Vr0 / Vr1.




Onto the main station area we have a number of signals. All station signals are Hp0/Hp2 and at the entrances as well as exit from each track.
The bi-directional tracks of course have one at each end. The branch line tracks are bi-directional since only one has a platform and so it needs to be accessible from either direction.

The bottom most main track is the freight track, also bi-directional.
The left end has a Hp0/Hp2 signal but the right end has a Sh0/Sh1 shunt since shunting manoeuvres can be performed into the siding and also into the freight depot.
A Hp0/Hp2 signal protects at the double slip so that shunting can be performed without interrupting the mainline or branch line traffic.
All other freight sidings, yard sidings and entry track from BW are a Wait signal.

Auf den Hauptstationsbereich haben wir eine Reihe von Signalen. Alle Sendersignale sind Hp0 / Hp2 und an den Eingängen sowie Austritt aus jeder Spur.
Die bidirektionalen Spuren haben natürlich eine an jedem Ende. Die Zweigleitung Spuren sind bidirektional, da nur eine eine Plattform hat, und so muss sie aus beiden Richtungen zugänglich ist.

Die unterste Hauptspur ist die Frachtschiene , auch bidirektional.
Das linke Ende hat ein Hp0 / Hp2 Signal, aber das rechte Ende hat, kann eine sh0 / Sh1 Shunt seit Rangiermanöver in dem Abstellgleis durchgeführt werden und auch in den Güterbahnhof .
Ein Hp0 / Hp2 Signal schützt an der Doppel Schlupf, so dass Rangieren ohne Unterbrechung der Hauptstrecke oder Zweiglinie Verkehr durchgeführt werden.
Alle anderen Fracht Abstellgleise, Hof Abstellgleise und Eintrag Spur von BW sind ein Wartesignal .




----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Eric Fuhrmann - Brisbane, Australia. modelling 1954 southern Germany epoch IIIa


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RE: signal design for new layout - DB 1954

#2 von CarstenLB , 24.07.2016 12:37

Hello Eric,

I have got the impression that you are using the HP0+HP2 signal a little bit to often. The "exit signal" could sometimes be HP0+HP1.
As "drive-in" signal before entering a station you should also forsee HP0+HP1+HP2.



Example: http://wiki.rocrail.net/doku.php?id=signaling-en
Chapter 5.4 Branches, picture 5.1 and 5.2

According to a Deutsche Bahn book the signals are a means of communication between the station and the train. The speed of the trains is defined in the book for the engine driver (for each part of the route including temporary speed reductions).

To be honnest an overview about your complete layout is missing what makes it a little bit difficult to relate the detail plans.


Viele Grüße

Carsten


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RE: signal design for new layout - DB 1954

#3 von applor , 25.07.2016 01:39

Hi Carsten,

Thanks for taking the time to look and reply to my question.

I have included a large overview of my plan, with the hidden stations removed to avoid confusion.
Note that 'A' connects with 'B' and that 'C' is a dogbone return.
The blue is the dual track main line, the orange is the single bi-directional branch line.



In regards to Hp0/Hp2 signals, I have used these because all my main lines entering/leaving the station have to traverse points set at diversion.
Because of this, trains are never able to proceed full speed as they must slow down to protect the points.
None of the entry or exit tracks are with points set to straight except for one - which you pointed out in the above picture and I will change to be Hp0/Hp1.
The Hp0/1/2 signal you marked would never be Hp1 because even the top track must pass points at diversion at the exit.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Eric Fuhrmann - Brisbane, Australia. modelling 1954 southern Germany epoch IIIa


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RE: signal design for new layout - DB 1954

#4 von volkerS , 25.07.2016 11:33

Hallo Eric,
the signal marked with HP0/1/2 is correct. A train comming from A and entering track 1 (top track) has no point with curved position. So the signal will show HP1. Opposite side of the station the signal must show HP0/1/2. HP1 for entering track 3 and HP2 for entering track 2. Your plan shows a saxonia track design for the station. This is in DDR. For a track layout in BRD (DB1954) in the station track 1 and track 3 has no point or crossing with curved position for entering and leaving the station.
Volker


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RE: signal design for new layout - DB 1954

#5 von applor , 26.07.2016 13:09

Thanks for the reply Volker.

I had a look at what I can change to better allow Hp0/Hp1 and updated the design to allow both directions straight through running.
There is one turnout I just cant make work, so we will have to let that one slide:)
I also realised two of my points at the south end were not required and so have removed them.

Tell me what you think of this instead:


----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Eric Fuhrmann - Brisbane, Australia. modelling 1954 southern Germany epoch IIIa


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RE: signal design for new layout - DB 1954

#6 von volkerS , 26.07.2016 13:28

Hallo Eric,
the new track design looks better. I think it s better to use a HP0/2-signal for track 2 to side A. Also the signals both side of track 5 will be a HP0/2-version. Why a HP0/2-signal at the crossing branch line / main line to track 6?
Volker


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RE: signal design for new layout - DB 1954

#7 von applor , 27.07.2016 01:33

Hello Volker,

Track 2, side A for Hp0/2 - Yes I will change that.
I had used Hp0/1 because it goes straight onto the departing track with no points, though I think I understand now that all passing tracks should be Hp0/2.
Likewise, I will change track 5 to Hp0/2.

I have used a Hp0/2 at the double slip point crossing to isolate the 2 main lines and branch line from track 6, which is a freight track.
This way shunting can occur on track 6 into the opposite siding and back into the dual freight siding without interrupting traffic on the main and branch lines.
Though I think the exit signal towards A direction on track 6 should also have a Sh0/1 signal underneath the Hp0/2 to allow shunting movements?
The other tracks from the BW and service shed areas I have used a Ra11 'Wait' signal if shunting is occurring on that track 6 and into the dual freight siding.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Eric Fuhrmann - Brisbane, Australia. modelling 1954 southern Germany epoch IIIa


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RE: signal design for new layout - DB 1954

#8 von applor , 03.08.2016 09:48

Hello all,

I have not had any further replies but I am hoping I can get confirmation about the use of the Hp0/2 and Sh0/1 signal for the freight track to allow travel to either the main line or shunt siding. Also is the use of Ra11 signals for entry from the BW area correct?



Lastly, I have had no feedback regarding my other area, the branch line terminal station with main lines below.

Should the branch line entry signals be Hp0/2 as shown or should they be changed to Hp0/1?

Since the branch line is speed limited to 60km/h would this be slow enough for traversing the points without need Hp0/2 go slow?


----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Eric Fuhrmann - Brisbane, Australia. modelling 1954 southern Germany epoch IIIa


applor  
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Beiträge: 214
Registriert am: 15.09.2010
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